What does 2023 HODL for Crypto? CEO Niki Marie Eckardt shares insights!

Niki 

Andrew: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome back to Lex Con Crypto. We are excited that you're here. We are approaching, quickly approaching the new year and what a year 2022 has been in crypto. We are looking forward to the new year. I think there are many investors looking forward to a, hopefully a summer thaw as we approach the new year.

We will have to wait and see what occurs there today on our show to help us through this conversation we have the c e o of Netsource. Nikki Marie Eckhart is joining us today from Alberta, Canada. I believe that's correct. And We're excited excited to have her on, and I'm excited to, to share this episode with you.

Nikki, thank you so much for joining 

Niki: us. Thank you for having me on your show, Andrew. I really appreciate it. 

Andrew: Yeah, we, as we've made our way through various episodes and various topics we've come through a lot of the. What I'm gonna call real low points in crypto through 2022.

And there have been some real some real big [00:01:00] ones. So just and I know this is o off the cuff and just out of the blue here, but what are some of the real low points. That stick out to you from 2022 in the crypto world as you think about it.

Any headlines or moments sort of 

Niki: stick out for you? I think it's obvious the Terra Luna collapse would be one of the biggest ones. F T X collapse would be another one. I think. That we have seen a lot of bad actors in the space that have really put a bad kind of a shadow on things. And it's created what I wouldn't call really crypto winter, I'd call it a crypto ice age

And it seems that is going to be something that is going to continually push into 2023. But I think those are probably some of the key situations that have come up. And I think it's really causing a lot of problems for regulatory commissions to come with true policy that's gonna actually bring the crypto industry to the forefront and starting to utilize that even more and more.

And obviously. . [00:02:00] We also hear about cbd, cs, we hear a lot about intervention from a lot of different regulatory commissions. So that, I know that's a big sort of a statement, but that's hopefully that answered your question. Yeah, 

Andrew: no, for sure. So if those are some of the low points are there any silver linings that you saw, from any disaster?

There always seems to be some. Some silver lining some good that can come out of it. Do you see any silver linings that come out of 2022 or was it just totally black, totally dismal for you? 

Niki: It's so funny, Andrew, when you ask that question, because the first. place. My mind goes, and of course, obviously I'm a seasoned lady, so I've been around for a while.

Reminds me a lot of the internet when it first came out and how all of the policy was going on and companies getting sued all over the place and all of that. And I'll classify it that the, probably the most proactive thing that I saw is we're cleaning out. The system. And with that clean out, it's going to help our community [00:03:00] move forward, I think, in a very more proactive way.

Yeah, I 

Andrew: think that's I think that's right. I think that there's there's definitely been a clean out of bad actors as you said. There's certainly been a lot of entities that shouldn't exist. And they've been obviously, For what they are. Yeah I wonder if you wouldn't just think about and share with us sort of your thoughts.

A as you look forward now into to 23 what are some of the things that, that you would expect to see and maybe hope to see? 

Niki: I think we have to be very aware of what our current economic situation is around the world. So when you ask that question, we're interconnected in with the regular stock market we're connected in in a lot of ways of how the world economy is, and I think we have to realize that. And I don't like, and I am very much pro Bitcoin. I'm very much pro on blockchain and all of that. But I think we also have to be realized and be aware that I think Bitcoin is gonna drop quite a bit yet. Yeah. From where it is now.

But that's actually a good [00:04:00] thing. Okay. What I do see is, More institutional investors coming into the forefront. There was a lot in 20 21, 20 22 at the start, and then they were cleaned out because of fear of obviously all of the bad actors in that. So saying that, my kind of predictions coming forward is I'm hoping that we get some generalized regulation around stable coins.

I think that we will probably see. Legislation coming into play from regulatory commissions in regards to the usage of certain types of coins. Obviously we've got the X R P Ripple case in front of the S E c. I would think that that should come to an end point, which could create a lot of change in the space, which will be proactive and positive.

I think that it's, we always have to remember with technology that. It's a significant changing technology that's creating. A whole new essence of how we do money, how [00:05:00] our payment rail systems work, how everything works around the world. And so we have so many different things occurring. So I believe anyway, that 2023 will be the year of more significant change.

I think we will start to see regulation in the area. I think it's a really good thing. And I think another thing that we're going to see too is. With the way the economy is. Future developments say around mid-year of next year? I think we're going to start to see some changes in a lot more countries utilizing blockchain.

Yeah. And cryptocurrencies. I do see that probably being something that keeps moving forward. We take a look at El Salvador. They're are, they're already looking at it doing this. We're finding more other countries coming into the play and into the space. And of course, obviously in turn too a lot of the institutions no matter how much FUD is thrown out there about that institutions are bringing crypto on [00:06:00] fast.

Yeah. And at a very fast rate, you take a look at Visa, you take a look at Goldman Sachs, you take a look at BlackRock. You take a look at all of these different institutions. So positive speaking, I think it keeps moving forward that way. Economically. I think we're gonna get our butts kicked massively throughout the next year.

I'll just be honest with that. Yeah. But I think overall, by the end of the year, I think we're gonna really see some big positives. 

Andrew: Yeah it's interesting to me that it seems like institutional adoption actually increased after some of these large the, these large bottoms that we saw.

And I agree with you. I think that it actually was a good thing to have some of these implosions and probably a few more need to occur because the market has been essentially driven by specul. And as we see the market mature, I think part of that is a def definite regulatory framework that institutions can have that, liability, comfort in order to be able to practice in and be able to work in and plan in, and all the things that are necessary for institutions to put [00:07:00] hundreds of millions and billions of dollars in, into the marketplace.

So I think that, that obviously as the market starts to mature, that will be a benefit. One of the concerns that I have, and I wonder your take on it is what I've been calling reactionary regulations. Like we, we've seen like Elizabeth Warren for instance champion a piece of legislation now in the Senate, and there's others who are who it seems have treated crypto as a.

until there's a problem that perhaps they can capitalize on politically and suddenly have some sort of like reactionary regulation. But as we see many times, the regulations they bring forward doesn't even address the problem to which they're claiming to solve. And I'm, my, I hope is, and my thought is that we actually have some real thoughtful regulation that is actually helpful.

That, that is necessary and. and hopefully is helpful to the greater, broader adoption. But how do you see regulations shaping up maybe, even from the UK and from Canada and from some of these leading countries [00:08:00] Singapore some of these places where we see.

You adoption and the regulation starting to take shape. Do you see it coming in a reactionary way or do you think that there is hope for a thoughtful and effective and useful regulatory framework that emerges? 

Niki: I think probably one of the things that we have to realize is a lot of it is built around the geopolitical situations that are going on in each individual country.

So obviously Canada has a different mindset around, just current situations and that, so when we take a look at Canada, and I can speak for all of these because our company does work in all of these geo these areas. So in Canada we're much more inclined to say the community come talk to.

What's going on? What do you feel or think is important? What is that type of a situation? Okay. And even saying that in Canada, we get the FTX is coming into play, which are these bad actors, it's manipulation. But come on, Bernie Madoff did the same dang thing and there was no crypto. So it's the same thing.

So can we put that aside? So in Canada I see it being somewhat more at the [00:09:00] forefront of saying, Guys, what do you see here? What should we do? How should we approach this? And then we're working together more as a team in the US you see the backlash because obviously politics in the US is quite a bit different than it is in Canada.

And sadly, I would say that anything that's current and new is weaponized. . And so we're seeing that in the US where it's being weaponized and like you talk about Janet Yellen and you talk about Elizabeth Warren bringing in policies and, and there are, I think bipartisan bills and that, that are coming to the forefront where we've got both sides of the house that are really interested in trying to make something work.

But yet in turn too, because there is so much differentiation, From, other more extreme areas in the government that are looking at it as being that, okay, how can we utilize this to embed our side? And so is it a political thing or is it basically a non-political? So when we talk about regulation in the US, for example, What is that exactly?

And if you can keep the [00:10:00] bipartisan in place and keep the rest of the crap out, okay. I think that's gonna be a big factor in how policy moves forward. Because obviously the majority of the locations around the world, what do they do? They look at US-based policy. Yes. And they say, okay, if this is what the US is doing, then this is what we're gonna do.

But in turn two, many countries are starting to see that, okay, we can. And I'll say it this way from that policy, we also have to bring in cbd, cs. We also have to bring in and look at a lot of other areas because now we're separating or could separate from the US dollar being dominant in the world.

How are country's getting around sanctions. So when we talk about policy and we talk about that, a lot of other factors are going to determine what that policy is because obviously us does not want to give up their power. They don't wanna give up the petro dollar, they don't want to give up. Now all of a sudden you've got a multitude of different cryptocurrencies out there, or potentially cbdc that can now you know, [00:11:00] without using the US dollar.

So I think when you talk about regulation and policy, it's a lot more complicated than just coming up and saying, here we can put a regulation in place and this is the way it is. Yeah. Countries can get around sanctions now. 

Andrew: I think that's part of the I think that's part of the issue, the crypto industry has been saying to Washington give us some regulatory.

and there have been very few political leaders, especially in Washington who have been willing to engage because of the complexity of the issue. It's not just that it's a new technology it's that it has, global economic impact and effects and the this is what I would consider to be in a long.

The first real, credible, viable threat to the dominance of the US dollar. And for the US political enterprise . It is a great threat. It is great risk. And I think that they are really starting to feel. The damage and the threat that this that this, technology and this new financial wave I is bringing [00:12:00] to them.

Niki: . Yeah, I totally agree with you in regards to that because one of the things I also see too is that, What we create in the blockchain and cryptocurrency is taking the power back to the people, right? And it's taking it away from those in government positions. And of course, obviously we all know that they try to keep it the control of everything.

And so I think that, it's very easy that for, people like Kevin O'Leary or anybody else to go in and say come on, all we just need is policy and things are good. It's, it doesn't work that. No, it doesn't work that way at all. And it, when they, when you talk about this type of regulation and that, that needs to come into play into the space, and I agree that bad actors have to be removed out of the space, of course, with the legislation and but yet in turn too, when you're taking away powers and giving it to the people, , that's scary for them, right?

They don't know how to handle this. So when we, again, with regulation, you [00:13:00] can go in a multitude of different directions and talk about regulation and say just slap this in here. But what are the implications of the regulation? Yeah. How is it gonna change the very essence of who we are as individuals and how we do peer-to-peer transactions.

We don't need the government anymore. We don't need the banks. That's another big factor in regulation and this is why how they've always controlled. The system before even was with accredited investors. Keep the rich. We don't want the general public to be able to have that type of power and control.

And what's the excuse all the time? We don't want grandma to lose her money. That's right. Sorry. There's a whole entire thing called the middle class, that aren't accredited investors that still have money, that still have the ability to do peer-to-peer transactions, and all of those types of things.

So regulation, again, is really based around these people in power not having a clue or being forced into a corner, which I truly believe that's what they do. And this is [00:14:00] why the s e C is just like bouncing all over the place. Yes. And trying to play, this big policing force. And not really coming up with anything that is going to help the process move forward.

Andrew: Yeah. Yeah. I think it, it's interesting to see, so I have two comments about that. I do think it's hopeful that there is some bipartisan action because it seems like to me for the first time in a long time, there are serious. Level-headed legislators on both sides of the aisle.

Who are taking these issues seriously? I think Elizabeth Warren is an extreme extremist who is so far off the beaten bat that like, Neither side really can come into line with her. But I think somebody like Patrick Mc McHenry I think that, the, there's obviously a loss in the Senate of Pat Toomey, but his influence is still gonna be felt.

Who is willing to work on both sides? There are a number of democratic legislators now coming who have, who are interested in working together. I do think that there's actually hope for some sort of a bipartisan action and. . [00:15:00] And if there's any benefit to the collapses of FTX and to Luna and others, it is that they are motivated and there is public attention on s you there being some work done.

And I think that there, there is a way to, to move forward. What I'm hoping is that there isn't this sort of singular. Massive, all consuming, trying to solve every problem with one piece. I think rather it should be, a large vision, but small action. Taking small actions, weighing the implications of those actions and setting it out.

What I'd love to see is for someone. Maybe the financial services committee or something to lay out for us a 20 year vision for finance in the United States and to say here's where we're going. Here is how that this could occur. Here's how we, me, mesh with the world, globally.

Here's where the dollar ends up playing. Just that. And then the legislative framework that. Would lead us or guide us to that place. I know that all they can think about is the next two years and getting reelected and trying to con, stay in power. And so [00:16:00] any sort of forward-looking type of policy is outta the question.

But I'd love to see some of that type of action. I 

Niki: would love to see that too. I've I'm sometimes a pessimist. I am an optimist too. So it, it has that blend. But my first initial reaction is that, , in order to be able to see change, we have to go to the top.

And the top is not the US legislators. Yeah. You're talking about companies or, companies like BlackRock. Yes, for sure. Those are the individuals that have to start to make change in the forefront. And for sure, I'm not a big fan of Larry Fink. I'm gonna be quite honest, and I'm not, when you're controlling that many that much asset how, where is that bipartisan thought process?

Obviously it's all based around making money, taking over companies, doing everything. Who does the Fed? You look at your own Powell, how many times have they gone to BlackRock and said, what do we, how do we get bailed out here? For sure. So I think in order for us to be able to true, put in true consistent policy we actually have to.

Bring it down to the human level, the [00:17:00] average person, and I think the messaging has to come from that because if we continually allow individuals such as Larry Fink, such as Jerome Powell, such as the i m f as such as the, the World Bank Settlement, all of these, yep. Oh, there's, yep. It, they're not gonna do it for.

They're gonna do it for them, right? It's the whole essence of why Bitcoin was developed was to take away those powers. People. I think right now, the most critical thing that I see to bring in legislation and do it correctly, okay, is to have better education. To the common people, those individuals that are out there throw away the thd, throw away all the rest of the crop, get people understanding what is in front of them and how beneficial it could be to them.

Because. We need to stand up as the people in order to be able to get correct legislation in [00:18:00] place. I do agree with you. We still have to go through the governmental process. We still have the s e c. We still have to work through all of that crap, right? But it's the old case like this. How many of them are there?

How many people are there that are in those positions of government? Okay. Tell me that. If not 250 million people in the US and another 25 million in Canada and the rest of the people around the world said, hold it. Wait a minute. Stand up, fight for our rights, do what we need to do here. That's gonna truly push legislation forward.

And I, and so it, what is it boiled down to? I believe it boils down to the young voter. Yeah, and that's, I think that's where it's gonna come from. We need, sorry, I'll say this. Gotta get rid of all of us. Cronies, , , the baby boomers, all of those individuals that can't think outside the box.

Our youth are the ones that will control that. Sadly, we have legislators in place right now that are those types of older individuals. So I know I'm going off on a little bit of a spew here, but go for it. I think we need to make sure that when we [00:19:00] wanna make change, We, the people don't realize the power we have.

You're right. You're right. Okay. And in order for us to be able to take power back, we need to stand up together. We need to break down silo. We need to break down all those silos. , we have to unify and become one in order to push it forward. That's why blockchain is amazing. That's why crypto is amazing, and I don't, I think and you have to always remember too, and again, I'm gonna re go back to the start of the internet again, which I had a company that was just building in put up a banner, and every person on the planet would click on it right away, cuz they'd never seen one before.

it's very similar to that. The internet scared the shit out of everybody. They scared the shit out of the legislators. They scared the shit out of everything. Then there was adoption, then it moved forward. And I think the other thing that's gonna be so important, talking about legislation and everything else, is having people understand that their own private information can be now held with [00:20:00] them, not held with large corpor.

Again, we could go on for hours talking about this. Yeah. But, 

Andrew: jump, jump with me into the, I think what you're starting to scratch the surface of is tokenization. And most of the conversation that I have heard has been around institutions or companies tokenizing, I've seen some people saying 2023 could be the year of tokenization.

Sort of how we move away from the cryptos and alt coins and, yeah. becoming much more in, into tokenization. But what you're talking about is an individual per perhaps having gaining power through tokenization. Maybe it's real estate or other assets maybe it's their own personal identity, things like that.

Talk to me a little bit about what that looks like and how that might have an impact on the our 

Niki: world really. I think the one thing, and I talked about it before, I think tokenization is gonna be really important, but I think one thing that we have to realize is that the powers that be force people through regulation to be accredited investors.

Yes. Okay. And this is one of the biggest [00:21:00] problems even with tokenization right now. And we talk about tokenization. I believe the whole stock market's gonna go tokenization. Everything is gonna be tokenized sooner or later. Okay. Record keeping is so much better, so much clearer. And we could go on, but I think one of the things that I want to really talk about is the defi.

Decentralized finance, the ability to do peer-to-peer transactions without having intermediaries. I think that's critical. Yes. And I think I think that you and I should be able to go together and say, Hey, you're down in, wherever you are in the US or, and I'm somewhere in Canada.

We can do a peer-to-peer transaction without having any intermediaries. Yeah. Okay. And when we talk about tokenization, think of this, we can tokenize everyth. Okay, but how would that change our lives for the better? Okay. Think of this. How much service fees do you pay over your lifetime to middlemen?

Now take that total amount [00:22:00] and if you could do it through tokenization to remove the middleman on any type of product or anything. You would probably keep millions of dollars, maybe millions of dollars Yeah. In your pocket that you could utilize to build generational wealth for yourself and your family and your kids and everything.

So when we talk about tokenization, this is something that I think we should all be looking at the forefront and saying that. And when we talk about decentralization, With tokenization, that's exactly what we do. We have that ability to do peer-to-peer. Now, the biggest issue with this is that I see, and this is why it's so important for the youth to be able to vote and to push these types of things forward.

To go to granddad or grandma and say, set up a wallet. That's, it's almost impossible. But that's part of tokenization. You have to have the wallets, you have to have all seed phrase, and seed phrases and everything else. Now there's already, and [00:23:00] within our tech company in that too, we're already looking at new ways to get around.

That side of it. Sure. You Whether it be full integrated retinal scans instead of a seed phrase. Yeah. and those types of things. And the technology's going is slowly growing. Like anything we have to push it through. Yeah. But eliminating those seed phrases, still having the control of the wallet and this is the thing that where we have to be also very careful about because.

As much as we like to think that things are going to be defi and things are going to be peer tope in the future around tokenization and everything else, we also have to realize that this is all software. Yes, it can all be monitored. And trust me, military grade encryptions and all of those types of things, they already break that shit.

Okay. So as much as we want to say that we would want peer-to-peer transactions, there's a lot of bad actors out there. I know we, we already discussed that. Yeah. So there's a lot of crime. Sadly, for every person that's trying to do good, there's another two people that are maybe trying to do bad.

Okay. And we have to [00:24:00] be aware of that. That's why we have those types of securities. But even when you take a look at it when our Prime Minister put in the emergency act around the, the trucker convoys and that sort of thing in parliament and all that. Yes. They could freeze bank accounts.

They were, yeah. What did they do? They froze digital wallets. Yeah. That one statement there, freezing a digital wallet. Now what? So as much as we talk about all of these good things, and I and it's always so funny when we talk about this because many people think that it's just very easy.

We'll just do defi. Yeah. Or we're just gonna do this. But for every action, there's going to be a reaction. And sadly, as you've already mentioned, Everybody is very reactive. Nobody's proactive. We are. We only are reactive individuals. That's right. That's right. So again, it's not only the technology, it's the psychology behind all of this too.

And those are interconnected, [00:25:00] which then brings us into ai. Yes. And how AI can now interconnect even into the token. Can even interconnect into blockchain and how that is, and we haven't even begun to scotch the surface on quantum. Oh, I know. and security. So now you're talking about how could quantum break down the chains, that's right. And another funny thing that I that that I talk about, and I you will probably remember this, Andrew, we talk about Bitcoin, we talk. All of these types of things, but Bitcoin I'll stick with Bitcoin because that's the most, the biggest one. Yeah.

That gives us that opportunity to have that essential freedom. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So here's something I remember back when Roosevelt went to all of the people in the US and said, give us your gold. You cannot have gold anymore. Could they do that with. Of course, so of course, we have a lot of individuals out there.

And I'm, again, I'm very proactive on all of this, but Right. I think one of the things that a lot of people don't do is they don't step back and see the overall [00:26:00] picture. The macro picture of everything that's going on. 

Andrew: Like you just said freezing, digital wallets. Especially in a, blockchain environment.

Yes, you can own your Bitcoin and yes, you can hold it into. , cold storage and do all the various things that, that you want to do. But the second that wallet address right, is activated on the blockchain. There are you're exposed and so there's certainly ways for them to be able to to either, confiscate or freeze or just make not usable.

I All, there's all sorts of, tactics and, that these things are already built in. I, I remember reading and the revelation of a few years ago, like that there was a backdoor into Facebook or there's a backdoor into this or that, or, even Snowden. And it was to me, I was like of course there is why, right?

Of course I don't understand why this is, and Like Coinbase didn't just get listed as a public company by accident. There's, there are concessions that every one of these companies in a global way has to make, which is what brings you and of the discussion back around to Bitcoin and it's gonna be very interesting [00:27:00] as we come to a conclusion.

This has been awesome and I've really enjoyed it and wanna. Really want to continue our conversation. But there's something about the New Year, and I was just reading today how Michael Sailor is talking about Michael Strategies developing and really building out the Lightning network.

and making making Bitcoin much more accessible and much more usable and finding opportunities for institutional adoption of Bitcoin specifically. A as you look forward, do you see Bitcoin. Continuing to be I think continuing to be a store of value, but also relatively marginalized in its utility or do you see Bitcoin really being able to start to achieve maybe a broader adoption and usability in the overall general market?

that's a really loaded question. I 

Niki: know, I know. Okay. I'm gonna answer it as easily as I possibly can. Firstly, I wouldn't trust my, my sailor with how far I could spit. That's one. Sure. Two. The biggest fear, [00:28:00] obviously is institutionalization. Now, think about this. The figures are right now retail investors that have, or owners of Bitcoin.

18%, right? That's it, right? Institutions own the rest of it, right? That's one, two. Okay. If you take a look at the the analytics around nodes, Okay. Two years ago, Bitcoin nodes were I can't remember exactly, but I think there was somewhere around, 70% or 80% of people utilizing and getting nodes and more people coming on.

Okay. That's dropped by 55% already. Okay, so there's actually less nodes now out there to do transaction basis. The other thing that I don't think a lot of people understand around the Lightning network is and how Bitcoin is distributed through nodes. So one node wants to say, move 10 Bitcoin to another node.

That other [00:29:00] node has to have 10 Bitcoin in order to be able to have the process move forward. , which is the problem because the only ones that actually can do that are institutional investors, right? Retailers, retail investors can't do that. How many retail investors sitting at their desks right now have 10 bitcoins sitting there?

Yeah. Okay. So they can't be a note. So now what are we doing? We're actually centralizing something that's not supposed to be centralized. . Okay. And so the Lightning Network and Michael Sailor saying he is building it out and everything else, you always have to ask yourself, is he doing it for him and his buddies?

right? Or is he doing it for the embedment of overall society? What did he do? He just bought another 2000 Bitcoin or some silly thing just recently. So again, we always have to be really aware. You can go to the Bitcoin conferences in Miami and you can go to all these places in all of the hype and everything else, and this and that, and how wonderful it is.

But once again, You have to step [00:30:00] back and see it for what it truly is and understand how these systems work. You can't just take it for granted that, oh, the world is going to be wonderful and great here, and this is why I think it's so important, once again, to ensure the fact that education is primary in the movement of our technology.

Okay. I always say this responsible innovation. . That's something I think that's critical. Okay. It's that responsible innovation and who has the control of the innovation and are they being responsible with it? Yeah. We haven't learned anything about climate. We haven't learned anything about, I could, we could go on a whole bunch of stuff because once again, where are we at being reactive instead of p.

I 

Andrew: think you've brought a great focus on and and highlighted, several times throughout our conversation here, just the idea of empowering people, of empowering the average uh, Citizen the person who's working hard every day and trying to just live their life and how that is overshadowed by the the [00:31:00] imperial elite that, that sort of sit on top of us e each and every day and rule our government.

So I really appreciate your perspective, Nicki. It's been very refreshing for me and helpful. In my perspective of things as well. So I just wanna say thank you very much for joining us today, for being on the show. If my listeners wanted to follow you or contact you or find out more about you and your company, how could they do that?

Niki: You can just get ahold of me on LinkedIn. Obviously I'm there. I we're p doing a lot of publishing of articles and that sort of thing. And you can reach out on LinkedIn if you want. It's just Nikki Marie Eckhart. E C K A R D t reach out. Great. Be more than happy and that we're right in the development of all of our new websites and everything else that are coming up as well.

Great. What I'm always happy to to talk to people and and work with people and in consulting and that sort of thing. 

Andrew: Yeah. Exciting. That's great. Very good. And I'll definitely I'll tag Nikki in the LinkedIn post when I when I post this as that's where the majority of my audience comes from.

So I'll make sure we, we post there [00:32:00] and make sure that there's a connection made. I wanna say just thank you again so much. Wish you a very happy New Year and look forward to speaking to you again soon, Nikki, thank you so much. 

Niki: Okay. Thank you so much, Andrew. I really appreciate it. Happy New Year to you and all of your audience.

Thank 

Andrew: you.